The “Black Swan” Plan

Nartalie Portman： I started training a year ahead of time with a great teacher， Mary Helen Bowers， who was in the New York City Ballet for 10 years. She started very basic with me， really focusing on strengthening my toes. We would do 15 minutes of just toe exercises a day to get ready for going en pointe， plus obviously ballet. And then we upped it to， you know， we added more time as we went along， more hours a day of ballet， and we added swimming. We swam a mile a day. We toned. I watched the Frederick Wiseman documentaries on ABT and Paris Opera Ballet， which were really helpful， and read a lot of autobiographies of dancers.

I tried to do mainly New York City Ballet dancers because I thought it was important to locate it in a particular culture， to have a sort of specific world， because every company is very different. So it was sort of Balanchine-era New York City Ballet that gave me the background.

It was， and， you know， it’s also you have physical limitations. You know， I have…I’m short and I have short limbs. And， you know， the Balanchine sort of City Ballet ideal is to be very long. And they had me working with a physical therapist， Sash Jairotani’s teacher， Michelle Rodriguez， who’s fantastic， who works with all the dancers in New York， to lengthen me. And she was literally just pulling my arms and opening my back and， you know， having me over a ball. I would be lying on this sort of small ball and she would just open my shoulders and open my back and do arm exercises to try and slim my arms and lengthen them.

I was given instructions to lose as much weight as I could without getting sick and， you know， was told every day sort of by the coaches and stuff that I wasn’t looking like a ballerina yet. And all of a sudden， when I really started dieting and lost a serious amount of weight， all of a sudden I started getting compliments from everyone. But it was very much like what that world is.

Behind the “Black Swan”

Robert Siegel （Host）： Natalie， you have been in the public eye since you were 11 or something like that， yes？

Natalie Portman： Right. I made my first film when I was 11. It was released when I was 12 or 13， I don’t remember， The Professional. Yeah. So I have relatively been…it’s not to the extent that the public eye exists today， I imagine， because this is pre- Us Weekly and all of those things. So I was left alone to party in private， I suppose， in my teenage years， unlike a lot of the young women today.

Siegel： There’s a new age that begins with Us Weekly？

Portman： Yes. Well， I think it really， you know， infringes upon especially young actors and actresses who are just starting out now， you see pictures of their birthday parties. And， you know， I just saw a picture of Dakota Fanning’s birthday party or something， and I was like， you know what， I didn’t have to deal with that when I was 12. So it was definitely different.

Siegel： You’re addressing a very specific question that I was actually going to ask you about， which was Us Weekly， frankly. And that is， I mean， when we see somebody taking pictures of Dakota Fanning’s birthday party for Us Weekly， I assume the family thinks that’s OK. I mean， They don’t just burst into your life， do they？

Portman： I have no idea. I mean， I have not had that experience， but I imagine that they do burst into some people’s lives.

Siegel： Really？Really？

Portman： Yes.

Siegel： So do you consider it a success to be pictured in Us Weekly or you lost that week when you’re in Us Weekly？

Portman： Yeah， I consider it a loss that week.

Siegel： A loss.

Portman： I guess in some ways you do have to court that sort of attention， that it’s not necessarily something， because it certainly hasn’t been an intrusive part of my life.

Siegel： It has not.

Portman： I don’t know if that’s because I’m， you know， boring to that crowd and they don’t seek me out， or if it is because of personal choices， but I don’t find it too challenging to stay out of that on the whole.

Siegel： So what about the perception that you think people…which people do have a view that you’re a good kid， and you went to Harvard and you’re bright and articulate. And you don’t seem to be in Us Weekly every week getting married and divorced. True？This is who you are？

Portman： Yeah. I mean， obviously， because， I guess， media like to make types that they can fit me into， the good type and other people get to be the bad type. And that’s been a blessing for me because I think it has protected me from， you know， this intrusive interest in my personal exploits. But at the same time， if you compared me to my university peers in terms of the level of seriousness and eloquence and all of that， I might end up on a different side of the spectrum.

Siegel： You’re saying that Harvard might be a faster track here than Us Weekly.

Portman： Yeah. It’s all relative.

Siegel： Yeah， it’s all relative. It’s all relative.

黑天鵝“養(yǎng)成”計劃

娜塔莉·波特曼：在拍攝一年前我就跟隨教練瑪麗·海倫·鮑爾斯開始了訓(xùn)練。她是位很棒的老師，曾經(jīng)在紐約市芭蕾舞團(tuán)待過10年。一開始，她從最基本的教起，集中訓(xùn)練腳趾力量。每天我們都會做15分鐘的腳趾專項(xiàng)訓(xùn)練，然后才是立腳尖和像樣兒的芭蕾。之后，我們增加練習(xí)的時間，嗯，邊練邊延長練習(xí)時間。后來我們還進(jìn)行了游泳訓(xùn)練，每天游一英里，進(jìn)行肌肉練習(xí)。我還看了弗雷德里克·懷斯曼有關(guān)美國芭蕾劇院和巴黎歌劇院芭蕾舞團(tuán)的紀(jì)錄片，這對我很有幫助。同時，我還閱讀了很多芭蕾舞演員的自傳。

在做這些準(zhǔn)備工作時，我盡量集中精力研究紐約市芭蕾舞團(tuán)的演員。我覺得每個舞團(tuán)都有自身獨(dú)特的地方，因此鎖定一種特定的文化，在一個特定的圈子里研究芭蕾舞演員顯得特別重要。應(yīng)該說，了解巴蘭欽時代的紐約市芭蕾舞團(tuán)對我理解故事背景很有幫助。

還有就是，嗯，我自己的身體條件并不出眾。嗯，我的……我個頭矮小，四肢也不修長。嗯，但是，理想的巴蘭欽風(fēng)格的舞者應(yīng)該有修長的四肢。導(dǎo)演組安排一位理療師給我做肢體伸展訓(xùn)練。她就是莎什·卡若塔尼的老師米歇爾·羅德里格茲，她非常棒，幾乎和紐約市所有的芭蕾舞演員都有過合作。她就讓我躺在一個球上，就真的在幫我拉伸胳臂，擴(kuò)展背肌。我就這么躺在一個小球上，她給我擴(kuò)展雙肩以及背部，做肢體訓(xùn)練，希望能拉細(xì)、拉長我的胳臂。

他們還讓我在不影響健康的情況下盡量減肥。嗯，好像所有教練和劇組其他人員都覺得我，嗯，我那時看起來還不像芭蕾演員?？僧?dāng)我真的開始節(jié)食，體重一下子減了不少，一時間大家又開始稱贊我的身材。但是，好像在芭蕾世界里現(xiàn)實(shí)就是這樣。

黑天鵝背后的“乖乖女”

羅伯特·西格爾（主持人）：娜塔莉，人們開始關(guān)注你好像是在你大概十一歲那樣子，對嗎？

娜塔莉·波特曼：是的。我出演第一部電影時才十一歲。電影上映是在我十二、三歲那樣子，我記不得了，就是《這個殺手不太冷》。嗯，從那時起……我覺得當(dāng)時公眾對我的關(guān)注還沒到今天這種程度，因?yàn)槟菚r還沒有《我們周刊》之類的東西。所以，我覺得，十幾歲時，我私下參加派對也沒人說什么，這和現(xiàn)在年輕女明星的情況可能就大不相同了。

西格爾：《我們周刊》還引領(lǐng)了一個新時代？

波特曼：嗯，我覺得它確實(shí)侵犯了演員的權(quán)利，尤其是那些剛出道的年輕演員，你可以在上面找到他們生日派對的照片。嗯，我好像剛才還看到了一張達(dá)科塔·范寧的生日派對照片。而我呢，嗯，我十二歲時根本就沒有這一類煩惱。所以我覺得情況確實(shí)變了很多。

西格爾：我正要問這個問題，坦白講，是關(guān)于《我們周刊》的。如果有人拍到了一些達(dá)科塔·范寧的生日派對照片，然后刊登在《我們周刊》上，我猜想她的家人會覺得這沒什么。這些東西并不是突然間闖進(jìn)了你的生活，對嗎？

波特曼：我也不知道。我是說，我沒經(jīng)歷這些，但我覺得對一些人來講這一切來得確實(shí)有些突然。

西格爾：是嗎？是嗎？

波特曼：是的。

西格爾：自己的照片登在《我們周刊》上，你覺得那周是成功的還是有所損失的？

波特曼：嗯，我覺得是有所損失的。

西格爾：損失。

波特曼：某種程度上來講，我覺得你得吸引點(diǎn)公眾眼球，但不一定是什么大新聞。因?yàn)?，顯然這些還沒影響到我的生活。

西格爾：的確如此。

波特曼：我不知道是自己不招公眾喜歡，他們不想知道太多有關(guān)我的東西，還是我自己不愿招惹公眾關(guān)注。整體上來說，我覺得要避開這些并不是太難。

西格爾：你怎么看待人們的這種看法……確實(shí)有這么一個觀點(diǎn)，你是個乖乖女，在哈佛上學(xué)，頭腦聰穎，談吐優(yōu)雅。而你好像并不是常常因?yàn)榻Y(jié)婚、離婚這類消息出現(xiàn)在《我們周刊》上，對嗎？這是真實(shí)的你嗎？

波特曼：嗯。我是說，顯然是媒體總想把大家歸類，而我被歸到好的那類，別人就成了壞的那類。這對我來說是件好事，因?yàn)檫@樣一來我的私人生活就不會受到騷擾了?？梢臀夷切┕鹦Ｓ严啾龋还苁切袨榕e止、講話談吐，還是其他方面，我都是屬于較壞的那個類別。

西格爾：你是說與《我們周刊》相比，上哈佛讓你更快地踏上成功路。

波特曼：是吧，我覺得什么都是相對而言的。

西格爾：沒錯，是相對而言的，是相對而言的。